Imhotep Evil

Technology

No denying the japanese are good in technology, but come one, it's not like the germans are behing or something.

The cars that set standards for what is to come are usually cars such as the S klasse and 7 series.

How about things like direct injection, ASF, twin clutches, sequential gerboxes, tiptronic automatics, adaptive lights, Hill Descent Control (codeveloped with Land Rover), pre Safe, and all sort of technologies witch are either unique and/or german made and/or implemented.
Hell I could make a list of world first and only, for the BMW ///M engines souly.

As for hybrids, well the concept of a car with both a normal engine + electrical ones is really old.

In fact Dr. Porsche build such a car in 1898 .
And let's not forget about the VW Taxi of the 1970s or the Audi Duo in 1989.
When the Prius was launched, Toyota finaly arrived there, 100 years later.

Japanese usualy refine a technology, but they do not (co)develope it.

I find the idea that the japanese have bested the germans in automotive technology ridicoulous.

But what I find even more ridicoulous and outrageous is those Toyota comercials in witch their cars are shown with all sorts of technologies that they did not invent/(co)develope nor were first to implement.


Power

The G35 and IS350 might have had more power (0 to 100 Km/h), but put this cars on a track or a more twisty and bumpy road, and they'd get beaten by the 330i.

And please don't give me those ridicoulous 0 to XYZ figures. If those cars would be put on the Nurburgring, not only that the 330 would beat them, but even the 325 might be to much for them.

Bruce

I think it's quite obvious German technology is amazing, in fact i never said it wasn't, i said the Japanese are easily on the same level of technology, they shouldn't be underestimated.

But to reach on the point of hybrid technology, you're right, Japan did not think of these orignally. However they are the first car company to succesfully make them work. They've refined the idea to the highest of standards as well as creating the world's first performance hybrid's. That is something the German's have not done - there speciality is obviously desiel's and that's something they've done very well.

As for the Nurburgring comment, the 330i would probably kick the the IS350 and G35 in the head, but i don't care, all that proves is that the 3 series is the more sporty of the two vehicle, but maybe not the most technologically advanced. Either way i can't say for sure, because i haven't looked at the full set of performance for each car.

While were on the subject of track performance, it's clear the NSX-R was a true track performer, but the another car from Honda, the S2000 ran around the Nurburgring in 8:38, which was slower than the Z4 3.0 SMG which ran 8:32. But then again, when we look at the Hockenheim Ring the S2000 MK2 set a lap time of 1:18.2 which was faster than the BMW Z4 3.0i which set a lap time of 1:18.4. Obviously the two times are amazingly close, but the "terrible" Japanese car won. In that same test the Z4 3.0i ran through the 18 metre slalom with a time of 67.5 km/h, the S2000 MK2 ran 67.9 km/h. If we move onto the straighline performance test the S2000 hit 180 km/h in 19.5 seconds, the Z4 in that test did 19.6 seconds and finally both cars achieved 1.2 maxinum cornering g's on the Hockenheim. Again numbers extremely close, so it's clear Honda (as well as other sporty Japanese makers) can not be counted out. Japanese technology is on par with German technology. On that front, the Boxster S crushes both of them. It's an even trade, because both the Z4 and S2000 are great sports cars.

Anyways, i think i've stated my opinion, i have nothing more to say.

Imhotep Evil

I don't underestimate japanese technology, but I see the germans in front.
That's it. The japanese probably are masters of refinement, but usually in the second wave.

As for hybrids, no they're (the japanese) not the first to make them comercial, at least with some succes.

First we'd have to clarify what hybrids mean.

Second you'd discover that until the 1920, hybrids, electric and even steam cars were sold. It was thanks to Henry Ford that the internal combustion has finally won in the 1920s.

Third, diesels, true the germans master this, but again people over here don't really buy hybrids. There are plans for hybrid diesels. But VWs TSI and now BMWs TTI solutions seem to be quite good in giving fuel eficiency also.
Hell there even some good japanese diesels, since here a diesel engine is a must.

As for the 3 series, they're usually all rounder better package, not just sportier vs. the japanese.

As for the Mazda, what does it have to do, with it all ?!

PorscheBMW

Ladies and Gentlemen,

There is no doubt that Japanese engineers are every bit as good as German engineers. It's not about the quality of their engineering, it's about permformance. I have owned three Z cars a BMW 525i and a Porsche Cayenne S. I have a 335i Coupe on order. You just can't beet a Porsche or a BMW for performance. - ONLY REGISTERED AND ACTIVATED USERS CAN SEE ALL LINKS - CLICK HERE TO REGISTER

Bruce

I made my opinion, you've made yours, that's all good. But i can't figure what you mean by Mazda.. I don't even see Mazda in my last post..

Anyways as you can see our opinions differ, i'm fine with that, and to let you know i hold no personal grudge.

Imhotep Evil

Sorry, Mea Culpa , the Honda S2000 high rever (love that little car).
Damn, I'm such a fool sometimes, mixing up things in my head.
OK, we all have our opinions. No grudge, cheers mate.


Actually I find it about the overall package. The japanese can sometimes put more powerfull engines, and might beat then sometimes on 0 to XYZ times, but on a track or anything besides a smooth straight road, they'll lose to the germans, sometimes badly. Ofcourse there are some stripped down japanese racer boy cars, but then there are also more such german cars, but a lot more expensive.

Bruce

Have you been drinking