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Internal Combustion My favorite car vs. your favorite car go here.. Boys with big toys behave! ;)



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Old 11-06-2007, 04:04 PM   #91
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Re: Motortrend: M3 vs C63 vs RS4

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Originally Posted by Just_me View Post
I cant recall I seen so much bashing from MB fans on M3 before. I dont think its the look thats behind all the trashing, it something else
Maybe it's that the M3 it's much faster than the C63

Or that AMG's engine sounds much worse.

BMW fanboys are starting to get defensive
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Old 11-06-2007, 05:00 PM   #92
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Re: Motortrend: M3 vs C63 vs RS4

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I am also glad BMW doesn't spend too much time on such trivial stuff and rather spend their time on what lies underneath like the independent throttle bodies a few inches below - form follows function. Another car with crap engine bay - 911 - another ardent proponent of "form follows function".

My POV would have been quite different if the engine bay was actually exposed like in R8 or F430, but it is not in these cars.
I absolutely agree with your final point about cars with exposed engines. When the engine is clearly visible from the outside the designers should put a little effort into making the engine look like the big, brutal powerplant that it is... but with 'normal' cars I couldn't care if BMW painted the entire engine bay in a Barbie Doll Pink colour.
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Old 11-06-2007, 05:19 PM   #93
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Re: Motortrend: M3 vs C63 vs RS4

As i was saying, who gives a damn how it looks? What's underneath is what matters... And in M3's case, there's a lot underneath...

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Old 11-06-2007, 05:27 PM   #94
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Re: Motortrend: M3 vs C63 vs RS4

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As i was saying, who gives a damn how it looks? What's underneath is what matters... And in M3's case, there's a lot underneath...

Thank God (and brilliant engeeners at BMW) for that !!
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Old 11-06-2007, 06:05 PM   #95
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Re: Motortrend: M3 vs C63 vs RS4

I think the CSL will probably have a CF intake like the E46 version had.

None of these engines looks particularly great, but the Audi's is a step up. But when you look at the M3's engine, you get the idea that the engineers kept the stylists at bay, so to speak. Like much of the rest of the car, it reeks of stereotypical German minimalism, some would say austerity. Take for example the oil filter housing. It's right out for easy access, unencumbered by the need to remove any cover as it does in the Audi (and probably the AMG too). It's not a big deal to remove covers, but it's little functional things like that that I wouldn't trade for glitz. Note that practically all of the fluid access points are grouped together on one side of the engine; can't help but think that that is by design.
The part of the M3 engine area that gets a huge thumbs down from me has also to do with function: there's no dipstick.
Frankly, most engine bays nowadays, excluding those of exotics/supercars, are completely underwhelming. Not even the megabuck 8C Competizione (with its red cam covers and all) has the dramatic appeal of this engine:
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Old 11-06-2007, 07:39 PM   #96
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Re: Motortrend: M3 vs C63 vs RS4

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... And in M3's case, there's a lot underneath...


I'll drink to that!

The thing with the M3 is every design element follows the 'function over form' message that BMW and M so proudly believe in when it comes to their performance cars.

The rear diffusor make look sexy with all those curved and very much different to other diffusor designs out there, but it still serves the function of increased rear downforce. The front of the M3, M5 and M6 have the noticeable omission of foglights due to the need for increased air-intake to keep those demonic high-revving engines cool. The carbon fibre roof isn't there simply for looks (unlike the CL63 AMG which has CF side mirrors, I mean come on, like that's going to make much difference on its own).

Probably the only cosmestic design element on the M3, M5 and M6 is the M side-gills. Other than that, these cars were designed by engineers, with the designers only adding the finer touches to bring all these functional features into one cohesive, appealing, emotive and DAMN HOTT looking piece of automotive metal (and plastic ).

I can honestly say I do not see the same level of focus and strictness in design philosophy with the C63 or RS4.
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Old 11-06-2007, 08:05 PM   #97
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Re: Motortrend: M3 vs C63 vs RS4

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Originally Posted by Beemer B773ER View Post
I absolutely agree with your final point about cars with exposed engines. When the engine is clearly visible from the outside the designers should put a little effort into making the engine look like the big, brutal powerplant that it is... but with 'normal' cars I couldn't care if BMW painted the entire engine bay in a Barbie Doll Pink colour.

I think the barbie doll pink color is really pushing it...
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Old 11-06-2007, 08:15 PM   #98
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Re: Motortrend: M3 vs C63 vs RS4

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I still think in the hands of the average driver the C63 would be the clear winner. (thats one of the reasons ive ordered one ) and i can only imagine that the majority of forum members are not race drivers and skilled up like Mr Schumacher. and are in fact average drivers (waiting to get shot down )


With regards to to the engine bays all current BMWs are underwhelming. My 335d has a big black plastic cover over the engine bay and looks crap. The M3 is no different.

And if the situation was reversed i bet my last GBP you 'BMW lovers' would be using the exact same argument to wind the opposition up
uhhh, what your looking at in the C63 engine bay is simply a flimsly silver plastic cover.....BMW didnt put the money in to design one thats as good looking-but they did spend money on making their car 400 lbs lighter than the C....
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Old 11-09-2007, 01:07 PM   #99
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Re: Motortrend: M3 vs C63 vs RS4

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Old 11-09-2007, 04:30 PM   #100
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Re: Motortrend: M3 vs C63 vs RS4

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Haha sure - if you consider looking good as being functional.

By side vents I meant the ones you see in the pic below on the front bumper - they don't cool the brakes. Race cars have them cause they are so low, air pressure builds up behind the front bumper and vent stops that, but in car with normal ride height, they don't serve any purpose - except look like a race car.


Those vents are there to cool the heat in the oil pressure. That`s not just a cosmetic treatment. At Mercedes-Benz, form still follows function, it`s there for a reason.
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